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I actually have 2 questions, but the first is this:
無視（むし）[ignore] is listed in the dictionary as a noun/する-verb – I *almost* get how 無視する[to ignore] can be a verb, but how can the noun part be… a noun…? All the example sentences show 無視 attached to する so I can’t see anything that shows it in action on its own. I understand that question might need some clarification on my part :PSecondly: I saw the sentence 「停止標識を無視しませんでしたか。」translated as “Didn’t you disregard the stop sign?” – shouldn’t it be “You didn’t disregard the stop sign? (no, I DID disregard it)”. 無視しませんでした is the past-negative form of “ignore”, so it makes more sense to me to translate the sentence as the latter – “didn’t you…?” implies the speaker is looking for confirmation that the driver DID disregard, like they are pointing out the mistake, which is the exact opposite of what I read the sentence as. Is this just a mistake, or can ～ませんでした be taken both ways (giggidy), maybe distinguished by the tone of voice?
Q: Didn’t you disregard the stop sign? A: Yeah, I disregarded it – stop signs are for chumps.
Q: Was it the case that you didn’t disregard the stop sign? A: No, I DID disregard it – did you not see me zoom past?Danke :)
I’m drawing a blank man.
Thanks for bumping the thread; I’d actually forgotten that I’d even asked this XD
as a noun (in english) “I put you on ignore because I’m sick of seeing your crap all the time”
maybe that will jog you a bit =) (nothing personal in the example)
“When the bill collectors call, I just hit ‘ignore’”
Anytime man! I just didn’t want you to think nobody cares! Hwahahaa!
@Narcoleptic
Very insightful!@Narcoleptic LTD: I’m not sure if you’re being serious :P Any computer terminology would most likely be in katakana or at least be listed in the dictionary as being so.
I’m being serious in the usage, but maybe my perspective is possibly a little weird. I don’t see it so much as a ‘button’ or ‘computer’ term, but more of a concept (especially in the social netorking example first posted, as that would be a status or category you would put someone into).
My brain definitely doesn’t polarize with the rest of humanity though =)
For #1 – Good question… I don’t know if I’ve ever seen it without a する on it.
For #2 – The しませんでしたか is one of questions where you’re asking “didn’t you _______”
It might be a little easier to grasp in present/future tense, tho. Try something like…
すしをたべませんか？ Literally means “do you not eat sushi?” but a better translation, I think is “will you eat sushi?” It’s just a more polite way to ask if you eat sushi. By making it negative, it’s becoming even more abstract and far away from the real question, which means it’s becoming more polite (weird Japanese!).
Anyways, back to the stop sign, it’s kind of like that. Sort of a double negative thing, which makes it make a lot less sense. But, anyhoo, the definition should be right. Main thing to remember is that Negative + question marker = Asking someone if they actually DO something rather than DON’T do something…
I don’t think I explained that well at all, haha :( It makes sense in my head, but when I have to break it down and explain it in a way that makes sense things start falling apart :(
Lemme know what part has questions and I’ll do what I can to help out with it tho!
#1: A する verb is a noun+する, so 無視 surely must have been a noun beforehand, before they decided you could make a verb out of it – it can’t really work the other way round (taking 無視 from 無視する), can it? :P I’ll just disregard that as it seems to be a complete mystery haha
#2: Yeah, ok, I get you on that one :) But that solution leaves another question: if negative+question marker = DO rather than DON’T, how are you supposed to ask someone if they DON’T do something? XD If 寿司を食べませんか？means “Won’t you eat sushi?” (or the like), how do you ask “Do you NOT eat sushi?”?
As for negative questions, it is somewhat similar to English negative questions.
We don’t really ask in English, ‘Do you not eat sushi?’ If we don’t have any idea whether they do or not, we ask (a) ‘Do you eat sushi?’ and they will answer yes or no.
If we have some suspicion that they do indeed eat sushi we would ask. (b) ‘You eat sushi, don’t you?’ and if we suspect that they don’t eat sushi, we would ask (c) ‘You don’t eat sushi, do you?’ and if we think they don’t and are surprised by such but also want to confirm such fact, we would ask (d) ‘Don’t you eat sushi?’
(a) すしをたべますか？
(b) すしをたべるじゃないですか？
(c) すしをたべないじゃないですか？
(d) すしをたべませんか？for statement (b) and (c) でしょう is also commonly used to ask for confirmation of a fact you believe to be true.
(b) すしをたべるでしょう？
(c) すしをたべないでしょう？-
This reply was modified 13 years, 6 months ago by
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