Home Forums The Japanese Language "MY" VS "YOUR"

This topic contains 7 replies, has 2 voices, and was last updated by  Konrad Trojanowski 8 years, 5 months ago.

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  • #49402

    べんごし が だいきらい です。
    I really hate my lawyer. (emphasis on “lawyer” because of “ga” kana).
    a なに が きらい ですか? (emphasis on “what” because of “ga” kana).
    What do I hate?

    My questions for these questions is how do I really know weather we’re talking about “my lawyer” of if we’re talking about what “I hate” and not “your lawyer” or “you hate”? Why aren’t we using “watashi no” or “anata no” which would make it so much more clear and makes it a lot less confusing. I’m pretty sure you just have to feel it out in the Japanese language am I right? Guess this language really is full of questions after all! :-)

    #49403

    Joel
    Member

    Context. =)

    Japanese is a very contextual language, and sentences will tend to drop everything that they can get away with and still make sense. Usually the topic is the first thing to go.

    On a side note, the second sentence is not a case of the ga particle being used for emphasis. The topic particle は can only be used for known elements – basically the speaker is assuming the listener knows what they’re talking about. Question words, by definition, are not known elements, meaning they cannot take は – they much always use が.

    #49404

    Im understanding this a bit better now, does that mean that when answering questions you almost always go with “ga” because theyre asking you if you like that certain subject. As opposed to “ha” which you would use usually only in situations when you have to make it clear that YOU like the subject
    ex. otouto-san wa asagohan ga kirai desu ka?
    does your brother hate breakfast?
    iie, watashi no otouto-san wa asagohan ga kirai jyaarimasen. Watashi ga asagohan wa kirai desu. (emphasis on myself over here)
    no, my brother does not hate breakfast. I hate breakfast.
    Is this kinda right?

    #49405

    Joel
    Member

    Not quite. You’d use “watashi wa” there because you’re contrasting yourself with your brother – perhaps confusingly, wa also functions as a contrastive marker. (Also, “asagohan ga“)

    I don’t know that Koichi’s “wa emphasises after and ga emphasises before” is completely useful. Or accurate.

    Side note: You refer to your own brother as just “otouto” (no -san) when talking to others. No need to say “watashi no”, because just “otouto” would be understood to mean your own brother.

    Starting to think I may have to dig out the grammar dictionary. Maybe I can find a thread where I’ve already typed up its explanation…

    Edit: Found something…

    http://www.textfugu.com/bb/topic/alternate-explanation-for-%E3%81%AF-vs-%E3%81%8C/

    • This reply was modified 8 years, 5 months ago by  Joel.
    #49407

    Otouto ha asagohan ga kirai desu ka?
    Does your brother hate breakfast?
    Iie, otouto ha asagohan ga kirai jyaarimasen.
    No, my brother does not hate breakfast.
    Watashi ha asagohan ga kirai desu.
    I hate breakfast.
    I edited it and this is my new version.

    #49408

    I’ve analyzed what you said and have made a couple of observations
    1. We put “ha” before “asagohan” and “ga” after “asagohan”, is this always the case?
    2. Is it even possible for a sentence to have two “ha” particles or two “ga” particles?
    3. Is it possible to have a “ga” particle” and then have a “wa” particle follow it up?
    ex. Hideki-san ga juku wa kirai desu.
    Hideki hates cram school.
    I personally don’t think this sentence is grammatically correct and instead should be as follows
    Hideki-san wa juku ga kirai desu.

    #49410

    Joel
    Member

    1. We put “wa” after “watashi” and “ga” after “asagohan”. Particles in Japanese are post-positions – they modify the word that comes before them. Particles in Japanese indicate the function the word plays in the sentence – so long as you keep the same particle with the same word, you can rearrange the sentence as much as you like, and not change the meaning of the sentence (though note if you jumble it up too much, people will lose track of what you’re trying to say).

    2. You can have two “wa” particles when “wa” is functioning as a contrastive marker. The grammar dictionary explains that “when more than one wa appears in a sentence, the first wa is usually understood to be the topic marker, the second wa is more contrastive than the first one, the third one is more contrastive than the second, and so on”. It then goes to give the example “watashi wa kyou wa tenisu wa shinai” (I won’t play tennis today), though I have to admit, I’m not quite sure whether it’s saying that I’d prefer to play something else today more than tennis some other day, or the vice versa.

    Note that you probably won’t encounter a sentence so wa-heavy in real life. Something slighly more realistic would be “otouto wa asagohan ga kirai jyaarimasen ga, watashi wa kirai desu” (My brother doesn’t dislike breakfast, but I do). By the way, the “ga” before the comma is a different particle to the subject marker “ga”, which you’ll be learning about later. Means “but”.

    Two “ga” subject marker particles in a sentence is a little more frequent, as “ga” always marks the subject in subordinate clauses (unless that subject is being contrasted).

    3. As I’m pretty sure I’ve mentioned to you before, the A wa B ga C structure is one of the standard basic grammar structures in Japanese, which you’re going to see fairly often. You COULD say B ga A wa C (cf note above about particles) but it’s not very natural, so you’re going to get funny looks. Note that A ga B wa C changes the meaning.

    The grammar dictionary says “C usually expresses something about B, and ‘B ga C’ expresses something about A”. It goes on to explain there’s basically three categories into which sentences of this structure fall:

    a) A is human, and B ga C expresses something about A’s physical and/or mental state – for example, “watashi wa eigo ga wakarimasu” (I understand English) or “otouto wa asagohan ga kiraijanai desu”.
    b) B is part of A, and C says something about B, which in turn says something about A – for example, “Maikeru-san wa se ga takai desu” (Michael is tall) or “watashi wa onaka ga suita” (I’m hungry – literally, my stomach is empty).
    c) B is a member of A, and C expresses something about B – for example, “jisho wa webusutaa ga iidesu” (On the topic of dictionaries, Webster’s is good

    It then goes on to give a list of verbs and adjectives that almost always take the A wa B ga C structure, like “wakaru” or “hoshii” or “suki” or “hazukashii”. And so forth.

    Hope this is actually helping, and not just confusing matters further.

    #49411

    Thanks so much because this makes a lot more sense now when I read it over and am sure that I have a much more clear background knowledge on the topic of when to use “ha” vs. “ga” as well as sentence structure! :-)

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