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This topic contains 4 replies, has 3 voices, and was last updated by Juan Larroucau de Magalhaes-Calvet 10 years ago.
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November 25, 2014 at 11:22 am #46866
Hey guys,
I really thought I had the rhythm of 「は」と「が」 tho I found a sentence that proves otherwise… Here it goes:
値段が高いレストランはあまり好きじゃない。
In this case I really dont understand the が and thats the only thing I dont understand… I thought that should be written like this or at least its how i’ld have done it, thinking in english or in spanish redaction (my 2 languages) and what I have learned of Japanesse (my 3rd language-to-be):
レストランの高い値段はあまり好きじゃない。
November 25, 2014 at 5:42 pm #46867Both the original sentence and your version are correct sentences, but the meanings are different. To try to see the difference, try reading each sentence starting with the word before the は.
Original: レストランはあまり好きじゃない。- I don’t like restaurants.
If we put the rest of the sentence back:
[値段が高い]レストランはあまり好きじゃない。 – I don’t like [high priced] restaurants.Yours: 値段はあまり好きじゃない。- I don’t like prices.
If we put the rest of the sentence back:
[レストランの高い]値段はあまり好きじゃない。 – I don’t like [restaurants' high] prices.I think your trouble with the が might have something to do with the way nouns are modified in Japanese. I can’t speak for Spanish, but in English we modify nouns in two different ways. One way is by putting adjectives in front of the noun: “the red car”, “the big house”, etc. The other way is by putting long phrases after the noun: “the car my friend bought”, “the house down the street”.
In Japanese, anything used to describe a noun (no matter how long it is) comes before the noun. So you would say: “the red car” and “the big house”, but also “the my friend bought car” and “the down the street house”. Sometimes, these descriptive parts can get very long.
So to say “I don’t like restaurants with high prices.” you need to first say “I don’t like restaurants” (レストランは好きじゃない), and then add the part to describe the restaurant.
It might help to look at these three sentences, all of which have the same meaning:
値段が高いレストランはあまり好きじゃあない。
高い値段があるレストランはあまり好きじゃない
高い値段のレストランはあまり好きじゃない。November 25, 2014 at 6:26 pm #46868AWESOME!!!!! now I get it!!! I was using が as part of the “main” sentence, the big picture, and not as part of a mini adjective phrase…. I didnt take 値段が高 as one thing because, for me, these kind of particles (がとは) kind of “divided” the sentence and thus my brain first tried to analyze
値段 ——> が —-> 高いレストラン ——-> は ——-> あまり好きじゃあない。
And if you look at it that way it doesnt make any sense, now I get the correct thing was:
値段が高 —-> い —–> レストラン ————–> は —————> あまり好きじゃあない。
Am I right in my conclusions?
November 26, 2014 at 12:33 pm #46869For the most part, yeah. The い is part of the noun-modifying phrase – it’s 値段が高い + レストラン.
But yeah, noun-modifying phrases can even be complete sentences, so it can be tricky spotting them sometimes. Main thing to remember is that they’ll never contain は.
November 26, 2014 at 1:58 pm #46870Ah yeh, i know the い is part of that phrase but I see it as the connector for the adjective with the noun and thats the only reason why i draw it apart, in my mind 値段が高いレストラン is actually only one thing, but to analyze it I took it apart. Actually only with the explanation of thisiskyle I was able to read LOADS of news in NHK Easy News that I wasnt able before, not because I lacked any grammar point or vocabulary (Which I do by the thousands) but because of the misunderstanding of small phrases that acted as a unity like in this case. I cant wait to see how it will be when I start Seasson 6 and on. Thnx for the answers
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