The Study Thread

[missingno15Member]

WHOOT SO TIRED BUT NEED TO WRITE A LANG8 JOURNAL TO PASS THE TIME. NOT ALLOWED TO SLEEP WHOOOOO, READ THE JOURANL TO FIND OUT WHY

http://lang-8.com/123987/journals/1356972/

[ElenkisMember]

I hope you didn’t fall asleep and miss your bus!

[クリスMember]

Thanks for the replies on the books. :) One of the things I’m looking forward to most (eventually).

[マーク・ウェーバーMember]

Finished part 2 of core 2k with an average of around 15 words a day. Hope I can keep this progress rate up! 20% done, only 8000 more cards and 1600 more words to go and I will be done with core 2k. I am aiming at being done around summer sometime though I can’t really set a time as to when I want to be done yet, because I have just finished midterms, and have no clue as to how many exams I have this summer :(

[isocracyMember]

@マーク・ウェーバー – just from your post on the previous page about RTK – did you find this helped? The issue with RTK I have is that there is no reading.. then having to find that Kanji to find the reading is a bit of a pain in the arse.

Let me know your overall experience and just your general use.. I’ve been reluctant in starting it until I have finished textfugu Kanji.

[MisterM2402 [Michael]Member]

@isocracy: I finished RTK a year ago. It’s helped a lot since then, especially with learning vocab. You don’t ever have to “look up” readings, you just learn them as parts of words later on, so don’t worry. Unless you find you prefer the TextFugu kanji section; just wait another several years for it to be finished :P

[GigatronMember]

So recently I have taken to watching “実況プレイ” videos on the YouTube (basically the Japanese equivalent to “Let’s Play” videos). Specifically, ones by a Mr “Sonomamario”, who has some of the most hilarious ones.

I got hooked on them ever since the article on “しょぼんのアクション” on Tofugu. I was very pleasantly surprised to see how effective they are (at least, to me) as an “edutainment” study tool.

I have picked up a lot of new vocab (by associating the words to the actions onscreen), and through listening to him talk, my overall “sound” when speaking has become considerably more natural-sounding.

So yay, go me.

[マーク・ウェーバーMember]

@Isocracy
Yes, RTK has been helpful. One of the best things you learn from the book is how to break down kanji in to “primitives” which lets you break down even the most complex kanji, to parts that are easier to understand. Also now vocab is much easier to learn, and it doesn’t matter how complex the kanji(s) is/are because you have already learned it. As an example I can take a very simple words 熱い. The meaning is simple, but the kanji is somewhat complex if you haven’t learned to break it down. For me this kanji is “mushroom, round, ground, fire. From this I have made a story, and so this kanji’s meaning is clear for me.
That is the case with all the 2200 kanji, and while some are hard to rememember, and don’t resemble the meaning of the words it is used with I still think it has been a great improvment from before, where kanji were just complex lines that I couldn’t figure out.
The only drawback was that it took 2½ months to complete, and it was some pretty tough months. It has payed off, but I would only recommend it if you have enough dedication to keep doing something so boring for 2 consecutive months.

[isocracyMember]

@マーク・ウェーバー + Mister – Interesting.. I will probably end up getting on this in the next month or so. I quite enjoy the Radical/Primitive section of textfugu then being able to actually apply that to Kanji.

On a separate subject, I wanted to get everyone’s opinion on Vocab. Something I find a bit strange is.. That if you place 15 English (or at least Latin based) words in front of my on flash cards.. Show me the meanings and then ask me to recall them when you flash me the card, no problem.. I could and have easily learned 10-15 new English words a day..
However, I’m trying to lay down 3-7 Verb Vocab ‘Doing Something’ – although I’m struggling and can’t seem to figure out why. I’ve maybe got 10 down to perfect from about a week worth of study..
This hasn’t happened yet, I make some vivid associations in my head, drill the words in Anki.. I’ve changed my outlook and learning procedure at least once each..

I know eventually over time it will just sink in, however I just wanted to know if anyone else has had issues with this section or has any good tips?

I’m at the stage now where I’m just going to move on and add some adjectives into the mix.. I’ll get bored if I just end up focusing on this one thing..

[thisiskyleMember]

You’ll find your vocab retention gets better when you know a lot of kanji. I think trying to learn a lot of vocab without it is making things harder than they have to be. Let’s look an example with kanji free study:

“a commuter pass (for trains)” – ていきけん
to get this correct, you have to remember 5 meaningless symbols (not easy)

now with kanji:
“a commuter pass (for trains)” – 定期券
to get this correct, you have to remember three symbols each of which has a unique meaning “determined interval ticket” (easy)

Granted I chose an easy example to make a point and not all vocabulary words are composed of kanji that make this much sense (at least to me) but a lot of them are and you drastically reduce the mental load required by learning the kanji first.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 9 months ago by  thisiskyle.

[クリスMember]

@Isocracy I’m going through the same section now and it does seem more difficult to remember. For me I think it’s the similarity of the sounds and the shortness (ききます, きます, いきます etc.). What I did to help was to forget about the ます ending and focus on the actual verb part, so that things didn’t sound the same in my head so much. Also, to drink, to eat, and to enter etc. you kind of know already.

I also made some associations with some nouns to help sort out the verbs, like まち is town so まち-ます is to wait (you wait in town). みみ is ear so きき-ます is to hear (they sound kinda similar), かい is shellfish so かい-ます is to buy (you buy shellfish). きます is like “come, ass” so that’s to come, to go is opposite so it’s いきます. It helped that I knew those nouns to help associate with, but you can make up whatever to help you remember I guess (ならいます is close to きらい, I hate to learn).

So after a few associations there were only a few left that I needed to learn “straight up” as it were. Glad I’m not the only one that found them tricky. :)

Edit: I’m only on the first set, so I’ll have to make up some more stuff to help get the others to stick when I reach them. The more associations you can make the better you’ll remember, it’s kinda like simplified RtK or Textfugu Kanji.

• This reply was modified 12 years, 9 months ago by  クリス.
• This reply was modified 12 years, 9 months ago by  クリス.

[isocracyMember]

@thisiskyle you make a very good point, I remember Kanji meanings and reading much easier than I do the vocab word alone in Hiragana. And actually enjoy it which is always a bonus. I think RTK is the way to go for this, I love textfugu Kanji, there just isn’t enough to satisfy me at the moment.

@クリス Exactly, the words I have remembered I have managed to make associations for, or even just remembered outright for some reason. ききます is my favorite! ^-^ I’ve been attempting it with the rest of the Vocab, but I guess I’ve just run out of ideas. I’m actually going to take a break for a day or so from drilling it hard to focus on something else. Think up some associations and just relax trying to learn it.

Cheers for you help guys!

[MisterM2402 [Michael]Member]

飛行機 – ah, the good old fly-go-machine ;) Or, as you amateurs probably call it, the “aeroplane” *rolls eyes*

[wiseguy12851Member]

I never thought of it like that before, fly-go-machine 飛行機, lol. Now I’m probably going learn new words a lot easier just because they sound so funny when read literally like that.

What about 日本語? Everyone’s heard of the Sun book language right?

[MisterM2402 [Michael]Member]

@wiseguy12851: Never really found I needed a mnemonic for 日本語, seeing how important a word it is :P

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